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Mad Men 3x09 Reaction (Patreon)

Published:
2025-10-10 00:02:42
Imported:
2026-06
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Content

ive been trying to upload the full 3 times and it doesn’t want to finish loading up, i don’t know if its vimeo or me but hopefully its fixed by the morning

Files

Previews only

mad men 309

________________________ patreon - https://www.patreon.com/LMreactions twitter - https://twitter.com/LMreaction tv time - lola - skysstillblue, milena - oneofthe100

Comments

Kara

All good! I sent you a DM btw, sorry if you've seen it already ❤️ just not sure if you read those

Taya

The hits just keep on coming. First Pete, now Don, and Betty "maybe it's not the right time for civil rights" Draper lol

Nina

Was funny to watch you expect SOME support from Don to Sal to realizing that he's not really any better than the rest of them.

Nina

So the Birmingham thing is the 16th Street Baptist Church bombing: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/16th_Street_Baptist_Church_bombing Perpetrated by the KKK, 4 young girls were killed and 20-ish more were injured. Betty heard about this and went "maybe bad time for civil rights?" GIRL WHAT DO YOU MEAN

JBK405

Oh there is SO much in this episode. The last scene with Sal is not him going after Lee Garner, but it was him going for a male hookup. The interpretation is that since he's lost his job, which was one of the big reasons for him hiding so fiercely, he is now 'giving in' to his desires. The 16th Street Baptist Church bombing was a watershed moment in the US Civil Rights movement (Along with many other watersheds around the same time). The public outrage helped galvanize motion (Along with many other public outrages around the same time). I think it says a lot about Betty that she goes BACK, and says maybe Civil Rights aren't necessary right now, when a large portion of the rest of the country was finally stirred forward. I am obviously disgusted by Lee Garner and Roger and Don for firing Sal, but I'm FRUSTRATED at Harry for not preventing the explosion. He shouldn't have done "nothing", he should have approached Roger or Don and said there was some kind of beef between them, and they could have sent Sal home that day so Lee would have never run into him in the meeting. It's still slimy that they're trying to placate a piece of scum, but Sal would have done it happily if it kept him in a job, and Roger/Don would have been happy to make it LOOK like they're doing what the client wanted. Harry could have saved the day by opening his mouth sooner. I consider this one of Don's lowest moments, when Sal asks what Don would think if he had been a young girl and Don says it would depend on what kind of girl she was and what he knew about her. He is essentially saying "I know you wanted it and invited it anyway, so this is your own fault". He's not JUST a coward for giving in to a skeevy client, he's skeevy himself.

Kara
>>189921466

I think I've said this before but contemporary polling showed that the majority of Americans thought that the civil rights movement was asking for too much too fast or that their methods were too disruptive. Even some supporters were like "slow down, be patient, expect less". It's an interesting coincidence to be watching these eps of Mad Men and Andor around the same time, with discussions about the need for violence and aggression and nonstop persistence in the face of oppression etc.

Eric Viola

"But when I say I want the moon, I expect the moon". This moment always stuck out to me more than most. Connie wanted a campaign that centered his evangelizing mission that he expressed to Don. A campaign about spreading America culturally around the world through his hotels. Don's campaign was about attracting people who were already American vacationing abroad to his hotels.

Nina
>>189923783

Doing nothing was the most Harry thing he could've done, he doesn't have the capability for anything more, he's a pure coward. He should learn in this episode that doing nothing is also a (often bad) choice, but will likely learn nothing.

Mike
>>189921706

I don't want to excuse what Don did AT ALL, because it was probably the cruelest thing he's done in the whole show so far, but it is interesting to consider the situation from his perspective: We the audience know exactly what happened, and that Sal is telling the truth. But from Don's perspective, he only knows that Sal *has* cheated on his wife, and *does* lie to everyone at the office about his sexuality. If he had willingly hooked up with Lee Garner Jr., and LGJ had demanded his firing anyway (a perfectly plausible outcome imo), wouldn't Sal be in his office saying the same thing? The show likes to paint Don as relatively open-minded, and I think Sal probably thinks (or thought) the same. But remember what he actually told Sal in the premiere: "Limit your exposure." Creating a major blow-up with the biggest, most important client at the firm isn't that. If you squint, you can almost see Don thinking that he should have turfed Sal months ago, back when he discovered his secret. Anyway yeah, horrible stuff from Don. Like Betty's disgusting comment about civil rights, the show likes to give you whiplash over your expectations regarding social progress. It's a show about the 60s! It's about the civil rights movement and burgeoning acceptance! Uh, no, not all at once. Most of these characters aren't there yet at all. *Speaking of limiting your exposure, that's essentially the warning that Suzanne gives to Don about their affair being too close to home. Of course, he doesn't care. Don being a hypocrite. Who would have guessed.

Mike

Totally fascinating to follow up the Pete story from last episode with this one, largely about the (very real) power the clients have over the team at SC. Watching Connie & Lee Garner Jr. take liberties with Don & Sal... the parallels are striking. And of course that's all contrasted by Henry waiting for Betty to come to him. Great stuff. Edit: Listening the post-show discussion, I don't think Don was implying that Sal should have slept with Lee to keep him happy. I think he doesn't believe Sal's version of the story (that Lee came on to him and he rebuffed him). He thinks they did hook up and that Sal is trying to save his job by denying it. Hence the comment "that would depend on what kind of girl it was, and what I knew about her". i.e. whether he knows that she "gets around". (Obvious hypocrite BS from Don, who is himself a serial cheater, but that's par for the course. And of course there is latent homophobia inherent to Don's opinion that Sal is that kind of guy. They all are, right?) Tenagrq, gurer vf n qvssrerapr orgjrra Qba'f eryngvbafuvc jvgu Fny naq uvf eryngvbafuvc jvgu Wbna, naq uvf crefcrpgvir ba ubzbfrkhnyvgl va trareny pbybhef guvf gbb -- ohg jr ner tbvat gb svaq bhg rknpgyl jung Qba guvaxf bs jubevat bhg uvf rzcyblrrf gb pyvragf. Ur qbrfa'g yvxr vg! Double Edit: It's funny to hear them holding on to the idea that Peggy must be progressive. That's why the show has to tell these kinds of stories with Pete (last week) and Don. Just because we love these characters doesn't mean they are great people.

Nina

This quote from MLK is extremely relevant to this episode and particularly Betty's comment to Carla: "I must confess that over the past few years I have been gravely disappointed with the white moderate. I have almost reached the regrettable conclusion that the Negro's great stumbling block in his stride toward freedom is not the White Citizen's Counciler or the Ku Klux Klanner, but the white moderate, who is more devoted to 'order' than to justice; who prefers a negative peace which is the absence of tension to a positive peace which is the presence of justice."

Taya
>>189931292

TBF Peggy hasn't really said or done anything problematic so far (that I can remember) and was very kind to Kurt after finding out he was gay. I'm sure if you were to sit her down and ask about her views, she wouldn't be modern-day progressive, but she seems to be as progressive as you could reasonably expect for the early 1960's. (I hope I'm not forgetting any glaring exceptions to this lol)

Richard Welch
>>189922012

Unfortunately you still hear a lot of that sort of rhetoric. I remember during the 08 election you'd hear things like the US isn't "ready" for a Black president, and you still hear it whenever a popular woman candidate is running.

cc

Don was an ally to Sal. Don couldn't care less about Sal being gay; if it were an issue, Don would've fired him the second he knew Sal's secret. If anything, Don felt closer to Sal for it. When Don feels he relates to somebody, that's really the closest we've gotten to seeing him look at another person as anything resembling a "friend" (Connie telling Don how relatable he finds him is the most recent example - it really got to Don, and you could tell it meant a lot to him). Don liked Sal. He went out of his way to encourage and compliment Sal's work a few episodes ago, which is something we never really see him do to anyone. He told Sal he was gonna hire him to direct a commercial again and, not only did he CLEARLY keep his word on that, but he gave Sal the agency's MOST IMPORTANT ACCOUNT EVER. DON WAS AN ALLY TO SAL. When Don says "You people", he's not being homophobic. He's simply a) being a baby and projecting his own insecurites about identity and living a secret life (like Sal is) and b) he's pissed at Sal for "getting caught" the way a friend would be mad at another friend; to Don, someone who has essentially had total control of his secret for years, the idea of slipping-up and losing all you've built is so unacceptable that he can't help but to be annoyed. It's skewed and detached and unfair of him, but I think it's really the only way Don knows how to relate to Sal in the moment. And it's fucking heartbreaking. Also, I choose to be optimistic about Sal. Whether you like it or not, getting fired led to him finally building up the courage to openly live his truth for what is presumably the first time in his life. And that IS a beautiful thing.

Kara
>>189940246

"You People" is homophobic. From the episode commentary: "And here's Don basically saying: Your dress was too low cut, your skirt was too short, or whatever. [...] He says 'You People are promiscuous', 'You People' is a stereotype about gay people that Don has. And Don is promiscuous too, but [he's saying] 'you people' can't keep it [together], it's so incredibly unfair." The other things Don says are rooted in gay stereotypes too. Gay men are slutty, they're asking for it, they can't keep it in their pants (perhaps they have sex with random bellhops in Baltimore hotels? etc). These are homophobic beliefs Don has. If your allyship doesn't survive contact with the enemy it's not real allyship. You can be as tolerant as you like, you can pretend your gay coworker isn't gay, even promote them etc. But if you don't defend them when they need defending, what's the point? That's when true allyship is tested. It's not even rare, we have people in 2025 who consider themselves "allies" then turn around and vote for anti-LGBTQ+ policies, who let their queer coworkers be thrown under the bus at work etc. If you're struggling to understand just think: What would Don have said and done if it was Peggy instead of Sal? What words would he have used? How hard would he have fought for her, how long would he have spent trying to fix the situation? I think we know the answer.

Julmor

I love how this show manages to make theyre main characters extremly unlikable, only to somehow make you empatise and root for them in the next episode. Don Draper in particular, is giving me emotional whiplash on a regjlar basis.

bondbond53
>>189946895

That's why I believe that if as a teenager one dislikes Mad Men then they need to watch it later into adulthood. It's such a realistic portrayal of human behaviour. Yes we often dislike these people and might think we're above it when we're young (after all these are our parents, granparents) but as we grow older we become all too familiar with these flaws that we ourselves have. Then our enjoyment of these characters is not in their big defining actions but in their small gestures, contemplations, impulses because that's where we feel seen. And then when a lovely, maybe bitter-sweet moment arises in their lives we can smile sheepishly as if to recognise these other moments of enlightenment or maybe mere comfort

bondbond53

There is absolutely no doubt Don is being homophobic in that scene and yes I completely understand that in those times it was a given no matter how okay Don previously seemed with Sal. Something that gives that away immediately, other than obviously *gestures at the whole scene*, is Don saying "You people". This is reminiscent of Betty telling Jimmy Barrett in episode 7 of season 2 "You people are ugly and crude" right after Jimmy exposes Don's affair with Bobbie to Betty. It's a loaded sentence and while she firstly refers to promiscuous, business, entertainment people she also subtly means it in an antisemitic manner.

bondbond53
>>189932304

Plenty of people nowadays seem to implement this rhetoric again. Nowadays mainly with transgender people. "Not yet". Then when? The answer is obviously never because let's be honest the only reason MLK's peaceful message had any standing is because Malcolm X was standing with a loaded rifle behind him. But then again it wasn't even peaceful enough because we all know how MLK ended up.

bondbond53
>>189926093

Yup, Connie's a cowboy, a preacher – he takes, he does not ask. Connie wanted Don's whim and courage in this campaign. Maybe he was missing this side of himself seeing as he's achieved all that one can achieve on Earth while thinking all the time about his business. How this greed complies with Christianity and God beats me but there's a different discussion there about American Christianity as a whole. And maybe Don would've been able to take his request for the moon seriously, after all he's the one that went above his means and imagined a future for himself and the one preaching to Peggy to expand her mind and go beyond. But in this case I think his father complex played a role in making Don want to please him and get praise and in the end result in something good but predictable. I believe one can be truly innovative when one doesn't care about other's opinions. The two of them were a toxic relationship as the girls pointed out

Kev

Spoilers Zvyran gnyxvat nobhg gur cbffvovyvgl bs Orggl hawhfgyl svevat Pneyn ohg ubj fur jbhyq abg qb gung... nabgure tevz nppvqragny cerqvpgvba. Vg'f nyfb vebavp orpnhfr sbe gur ybatrfg gvzr V npghnyyl unq gur zvfpbaprcgvba gung guvf JNF jung Orggl sverq Pneyn sbe, orpnhfr fur fnj ure jvgu Urael naq Orggl whfg sryg hapbzsbegnoyr naq jnagrq gb or fher. Ohg vg gheaf bhg V zvferzrzorerq naq vg'f n jubyr frnfba njnl, naq orpnhfr Pneyn yrg Tyra va gb frr Fnyyl. Hayvxrnoyr Orggl qbrf abg yrg hc va guvf fubj. Ohg gb or snve nf jr'ir frra erpragyl, vg'f abg qvssrerag sbe Qba be Crgr. Naq Crttl jvyy unir n zrna fgernx yngre ba, gbb...

Patrick

‘That’s us’ lmao. I always hated this story for Sal, but it’s unfortunately realistic especially for the time. I think they write it so you hope Don will say the right thing but again he’s not the hero we want a lot of the time.

Kara
>>189988340

Vg'f gur jbefg guvat fur qbrf gur jubyr fubj, cebonoyl. Whfg tevz. N ybg bs gur rneyl pbzzragf ba gur ernpgvbaf jrer 100% crbcyr jub ner nppvqragnyyl ergebnpgviryl nccylvat gurve srryvatf nobhg yngre Orggl gb F1 Orggl yby.

Kara
>>189982518

+1. In that scene Jimmy even replies: "What people? Comedians?", a joke about the antisemetic tone cuz he knew what she meant.

Truemeathead

Not sure if anyone mentioned it but Sal was in a park, probably the brambles in Central Park. According George Takei that was the spot for gay men in the 60’s to go hook up especially if you were closeted. He said he had many a liaison back in the 60’s during his Star Trek days.

Thomas Fahey

This show depicts every aspect of society in such granular detail it's astonishing.

Kara

Betty wrote henry "Does anyone read this?" and Henry replied "Not any more", meaning he asked his secretary to stop reading letters so they could send letters in private. I forgot they even sent each other letters, its very old school, like a Jane Austen novel courtship lol. "Not every day. Ha ha." betty with the text jokes, she should have been born in 1997, she has a poster's spirit. It's funny that Betty doesn't understand how affairs work because she never had one. She should ask Don for tips & tricks. It's easy to miss but Pete actually doesn't smoke at all, that's why Lee Garner Jr is forcing him to smoke for a "joke" (e.g he's an asshole). There's probably stuff you can read from this choice, maybe Pete believes the health concerns, it's a more modern attitude, it's definitely another piece in the "pete is a little boy" evidence pile ("I'm not allowed, it's bad for me, my mom said i cant"). Pete and Bert Cooper are two characters who specifically don't smoke, and Harry quit in S1 though I forgot if he stuck to it. Connie like all 'billionaires' is an asshole but I do find him interesting. He has the attitude a lot of poor working class people have when they accidentally become ludicrously successful and realize they're surrounded by sycophantic yes-men and born-rich dillweeds. Even his kids are spoiled from lack of struggle (its giving Succession), his granddaughter will be Paris Hilton, "famous for being rich + famous". He calls himself "King Midas", who turned everything he touched to gold. So he sees himself surrounded by all this wealth, ruining anything he touches, when all he wants is to do is drink shitty prohibition hooch and yap at someone who 'gets it'. He wants a friend but at that level, all his relationships are transactional including his with Don. Bonus thoughts: It's interesting that both Don and Henry have jobs that can reminds Betty of them in the newspaper (advertising and politics). I really like Don's Hilton ad, he tapped into things Hilton said in a deep way, but I legit think Hilton wanted a hotel on a moon lol. I like that Suzanne (teacher) isn't under any impressions, she straight up tells Don its stupid to cheat with someone in your life, in the same neighborhood.

Kara
>>190027302

It's 'The Ramble' in Central Park but yeah, I assume every big city has 1+ parks that were used for gay cruising/hookups. Hampstead Heath in London is famous for it.

bietz

Make no mistake, Betty voted for Trump 3 times.

SmallWoodenDuck

Did the full reaction for 309 never get uploaded?

mundanelotus

Is the full reaction for this episode still not available? :(