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Heartstopper S2E7 - "Sorry" - Questions! (Patreon)

Published:
2023-08-31 22:08:15
Imported:
2026-06
Tags:

Content

Let me know if you would NOT like your name included with the question during the episode!

NO SPOILERS PAST S2E7 PLEASE!!!

WHAT IS QUESTION TIME?: Here you can ask me ANY questions related to the episode or show as a whole. I will read and answer them at the end of the episode so they will be included within the reaction itself! Because I only read them after finishing the episode, feel free to include any spoilers relating to episode, just no spoilers after this point!!!

Comments

Isis Rose

You probably already went over this in the episode, but can we take a moment to appreciate the MASSIVE amount of growth that Tao has done to be able to so quickly roll with the punch of learning that Elle was accepted to the far-away school and didn't tell him? And to even understand why she didn't tell him, and not be defensive about it? The Tao of just a few episodes earlier would have absolutely melted down in this situation, and I love how much he's matured over this season.

Cole

Did you happen to notice that Elle’s painting was inspired by the one she stared at in the Louvre?

Cole

Do you have any thoughts on the difference of Charlie’s bullies having been at school while Nick’s bully lived at home with him?

Charlie

How do you feel about the conclusion of Ben’s arc in the series? Do you think he realized, after Charlie eviscerated him, that his apology was self-serving? What are your thoughts on how much Ben will actually learn and change from this?

Cole

What are your thoughts on the parallels of Darcy and Ben being in very similar home-life situations?

Sue Porter

You may have already covered it but curious about your take on bens apology. I found it a collection of sentences with no real meaning, designed to manipulate Charlie into taking him back. It's always worked in the past. We saw it in ep1 of s1, where he apologises for ignoring him because he wanted kissing. And in ep3 at harrys party, then insulting him because he went to walk away. How he always says I'm trying to be nice. How he takes advantage of Charlie's crush to get what he wants. He doesn't care about what Charlie wants, even after being told he doesn't want to meet up with Ben anymore, even after being told on sports day to leave him alone, even after Charlie refuses to speak to him in s4 that prompts Imogen's outburst, even after Charlie refuses to kiss him in truth or dare and even after Charlie refuses to respond to his texts. Not to mention the sexual assault (spoiler -he's worse in the books) Bens apology rings hollow because in one breath he says Charlie didn't give him enough time and in the next that his parents would never accept who he is. It's all about Ben and what he wants. Nothing has changed. I was so proud of Charlie for not forgiving him.

Tom Bendall
>>116505452

Personally, I feel like him walking away from the rainbow wave is him choosing to turn his back on the opportunity to change and earn redemption

Leila Davis-Middleton

i think the imagery of ben walking way from the rainbow wave is one of my favourite pieces of symbolic imagery from this show (i only hate that it features ben) AND the colours of the aroace flag on the leaves around isaac, which we saw glimpses of last episode - what has been your favourite use of animation this season so far? we also finally have a bit of clarity on darcy's home life after the last scene- which gave me goosebumps when i first watched, the animation and the music and the acting (according to kizzy edgell, that scene is all improv between them and the actress who plays darcy's mum)... a stellar scene all around, my heart broke for darcy - and i do quite possibly almost hate darcy's mum more than david or ben, but that's beside the point. i don't really have a question on this, i just wanted to share. it's interesting to note, also, that there's an interesting parallel with darcy and ben's characters, given what we learn about both their families in this episode, and i'm curious to know if you picked up on it? perhaps you might by the time we inevitably get the bigger picture from darcy herself, because there's 100% an intentional parallel.

Emily Brown

Obviously, throughout the show Ben and Nick have been foils for each other and the rainbow tide which Ben walks away from continues this metaphor. Did you notice the seagulls and other beachy sounds that accompanied that tide? I think it’s intended to evoke Nick and Charlie’s beach date, when Nick goes running into the water, first declaring his romantic like of Charlie and later when he wades even deeper carrying Charlie and joyously shouting about them being boyfriends. Nick ran into the rainbow tide, but Ben runs away.

Charlie
>>116505452

I agree as well. I think him walking away showed him turning his back not just on redemption but also on understanding and accepting himself and his sexuality. As much as I LOATHE Ben and do not believe he deserves a redemption arc, it breaks my heart to see someone full of so much self-hatred that they can never recover from it

Charlie
>>116507415

As a parent, I can say with certainty that I despise Darcy’s mom more than any other parent on the show, and probably equal to my hatred of Ben. To treat your child like trash and to make them hate themselves is just despicable

Olivia

when their dad says ‘call me when you get back to to edinburgh’ and david corrects him on the fact that his university is actually in glasgow, do you think something finally clicks in davids mind that his dad isnt this great man which he idolises/looks up to and is in fact someone who simply doesnt even care enough to know where his son goes to university? on that note, when their dad leaves he still gives david a hug even after everything he instigated at dinner and nick just a pat on the shoulder - what are your thoughts on this?

Steve Teeter

I think Nick standing there with his arms tightly folded across his chest is giving a clear signal that there will be no hugs tonight. That's why there was just a shoulder pat. I think Stephane (that's his name, isn't it?) would have hugged Nick if Nick had permitted it, but at that moment Nick was in no mood to do his father any favors.

Cherish would like a pet fox please and thank you

I was so giddy listening to your opinions in previous reactions about where you want Ben's storyline to go... because I knew this episode was gonna deliver on all that!!! It really shows how insightful and attentive you are. I'm sure you felt a lot of catharsis in the confrontation scene this episode. Although you were pretty much spot on, was there anything about that conversation with Charlie that surprised you? Also, we could all agree that Ben doesn't realize the damage he causes to people around him-- do you think he genuinely doesn't understand, like a sociopath would, or do you think it's more denial/willful ignorance?

Cherish would like a pet fox please and thank you

A few minor things about series antagonists that I want your opinion on- Would you agree that the bigger motivatior for ben to come "apologize" to Charlie wasn't anything Charlie himself did, but rather his fall in popularity at school? Ben was seen hanging out with the 'popular' rugby boys often, but he doesn't actually play- and it isn't like he's friendly and talented like Nick, or rich and ""entertaining"" like Harry. He seems more boring and gloomy to be honest. It's easy to see how he could've been isolated after his reputation deteriorated. How much of that do you think affected him and his decisions? I think we can all see that Nick takes after his mom and David takes after his dad. Would you agree that a major (perhaps the biggest) reason why david is so insensitive and crass is because of his massive daddy issues? Sure Nick resents his dad, but David was older than Nick when his dad left and was presumably more affected by it. David habitually brings up his dad out of the blue whenever he feels insecure, for one, even though he isn't actually as close to him as one might assume. Connecting this to how Ben's clearly stuck-up parents must have influenced him for the worse, how much would you excuse a character's actions based on their upbringing? Is it different for young adults like David compared to minors like Ben or Harry? Do you have any other insight as to how utterly different the Nelson brothers turned out to be?

Kohl

This is a show that obviously loves parallels between characters. Previously we've [obviously] seen Nich and Ben paralled, mostly in season 1 but definitely some in season 2. A new parallel we got in season 2 is the parallel between Darcy and Charlie. Charlie in episode 1 says that "everything is going to be perfect" in reference to Nick's entire coming out experience, with the explicit implication of Charlie making sure everything goes perfectly. In episode 6 Darcy says "everything has to be perfect for Tara, she's a princess" in direct reference to Tara's party. Now this episode we see Darcy literally getting kicked out of her own home and Tara is none the wiser. Do you think that Darcy's actions in the show imply that her "making everything perfect for tara" is an extended pattern? Also, I'd be loathe not to mention the fact that the episode of season 2 that finally forces Darcy to stop lying to the audience about her home life and forces her to reveal how much pain she's been keeping from Tara because she loves her, is the same exact episode where Ben actively uses the potential of his home life becoming terrible as an excuse as to why he has consistently treated Charlie horribly. What do you think the show writers are trying to tell the audience with this framing of the episode?

Cherish would like a pet fox please and thank you

What are your thoughts on Sahar and Imogen's friendship so far? They seem close(probably the closest female friend Imogen has) based on them having been friends for at least a year, and them cuddling in tara and darcy's room the night of tara's birthday party. There is also some undercurrent of tension and miscommunication between them: they grew distant for a bit after imogen got a boyfriend although they don't agree on who first stopped texting, and also imogen had no idea this whole time sahar is bisexual.

Leila Davis-Middleton
>>116507415

honestly!!! to make your child hate themselves essentially to the point they don't feel worthy of love is just evil.

Isis Rose
>>116504585

OMG thank you it had been bothering me so much that I couldn't figure out what her reaction to that painting was about!

Kay

not so much a question as two little Easter eggs for you... in the scene outside Nick's house, when Charlie said "... I'm here for you, mate..." there's a direct callback to S1EP2 when he says "Supportive Straight Friend" which is what Charlie calls Nick in their first text session. He says "thanks for being my supportive straight friend." To which Nick replies "Lol that's okay!" There is also another little parallel when they're in the thrift shop and Nick asks Charlie to Prom, and then starts back peddling there's a parallel of S1EP6 at the milkshake cafe when Charlie says "we should go on a date just us" before back peddling. I love little call backs and parallels in this show!

Kat
>>116573240

Something I’m curious about with Ben’s apology is what he hoped the outcome would be. As Charlie mentioned, obviously on a base level Ben wanted to move forward with a clear conscience. But I found the wording of “I’m not going back to Truham for sixth form so IF you really hate me after this you’ll never see me again” to be interesting. Did you think Ben thought there was a possibility of Charlie forgiving him, and Ben then being able to stay in his life somehow, or that he even might be able to win Charlie back? Or was he aware that was a lost cause at this point (especially after seeing on Instagram that Nick is basically out to the school)?

tova~

(taking the opportunity to ask this now since you're doing question time later than usual - hope you don't mind!) there's a blink-and-you'll-miss-it moment when Charlie's parents are thanking Nick's mum for the dinner and saying goodbye, and Nick's mum apologises for "all the drama", to which Charlie's mum answers "oh, we are very used to drama in our house". it wouldn't have stuck out to me as much as it does if it wasn't for the scene just before that one, when David refers to Charlie as Nick's "drama-queen boyfriend" and Tori literally threatens to end him if he spoke about her brother like that again. now, she could have been referring to his dismissive tone of voice or general attitude about the way he was speaking about Charlie, but considering Tori has quite a lot of knowledge about Charlie's ups and downs and has had Charlie say to her that he feels it would be better if he didn't exist (1x08), I'd imagine David's choice of words definitely rubbed her the wrong way. you didn't seem to catch it in the episode, or if you did you didn't give much thought to the passing comment from Charlie's mum, but I'd be curious to hear your thoughts on this if you have any now that I'm bringing it up. I don't exactly think it was a coincidence that Charlie is referred to as being 'dramatic' by two separate characters in two consecutive scenes, especially since the word 'dramatic' has quite the history of being used for people with mental health issues like Charlie, and Tori's go at David for talking about Charlie like that.