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Star Trek TNG 3x12 Full Reaction! (Patreon)

Published:
2024-11-16 18:00:08
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2026-06
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Star Trek TNG 3×12 Full Reaction

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Ryan

This is another one that probably would have come off pretty well in the first two seasons, but can't measure up to most of this one. Though we can be thankful we're getting it here, because you can just imagine how things would have gone with the crew written the way they were back then. "Now look, Dimitri, I'm perfectly capable of being just as sorry as you are. So we're both sorry, okay?" Michael Piller and Ron Moore were both disappointed in how it turned out, saying it played at making a big statement about contemporary politics while actually saying nothing more than "Uh, dudes, violence is, you know, BAD, right?" Or as I now call it, the Alex Garland message. And this actually wasn't the fault of the ever unpredictable Melinda Snodgrass, who was quite unhappy to have her much harder hitting script sanitized into this. And yes, she did acknowledge this year how off base she was stating that Ireland would be reunified in 2024, admitting that the century turn partway through made that year feel a lot further away than it was, and she should have put it somewhere in the 2100s.

Thomas Corp

Heavy topics again this week. Don’t know which would have been worse, watching this before or after the Lilia episode of Agatha. That one’s a toss-up. Fair that you say this one is one you got to sit with for a second to ascertain precisely what your feelings are about it. I quite enjoyed it, which I know is not strictly speaking the most popular opinion. A big reason for the enjoyment is the Beverly focus, shown very well right away. People are hurt. People are wounded. Beverly’s going to do what she’s got to do. It’s what it is. I have a funny moment of imagining if I ever have a wife or girlfriend, and it’s a situation like with Picard insisting on beaming Beverly up, particularly, I can see my brother in Riker’s place, saying that he would not want to be the one to confront her when she gets back. Shared thing of sensing Beverly getting kidnapped early. Richard Cox is good as Finn. Loved you speaking for Beverly by saying her name is “Fuck off” when Finn is trying to get her to eat and inquires what her name is. Clearly, he’s not dealt with medical personal, theatre folk, or teachers; they can subsist on coffee for a month. Gates sold well the cold stare of defiance. You mention that she should have socked him in the jaw, makes me say, “Now, Jess, punching him right in the jaw sounds too magnanimous. What Beverly should do is give him a shot right in the pills. That’s what she should do.” Bringing us to the slight knock against the episode that you expressed, and as Ryan detailed, the writers held a similar view. I love the topics tackled: when and where is violence good for gaining independence, when and where the difference lies, and how blurry it can get. Data even citing occasions when violence did work out, such as the Irish unification of 2024, which, clock’s ticking on that one, Data, just so you know. The slight problem is that it does paint a simplistic picture of that, yet what we do get is great. More of Kerrie Keane as Alexana would have been much appreciated as I’m with you on finding her a very interesting character, especially how she defends the somewhat extreme measures that she is forced to take, whilst never really saying any said extreme measures are right, rather, she’s desperate enough, the situation is bad enough that they don’t really have much in the way of other options. Feels similar to Let That Be Your Last Battlefield where they kind of want both sides to be relatively grey, yet the sympathies skew against the one party, which happens when you take Beverly hostage. It still works in that you get how everyone’s been forced into their... sense of justice, just, as you say, sinking our teeth into it more than we did would have been appreciated. Love Picard being just such a dad to Wesley, and how he keeps Wesley out of the immediate physical danger, whilst directing his strengths to be better served in saving his mom, and Wil sells it how Wesley wants to argue, but recognizes Picard is right. He, Geordi, and Data did the work, and it was great to see Wesley get that time to shine. Shared liking how Riker is uninterested in the politics and just wants to get Beverly back. Sadly, this shows that Finn is operating under an If You Give a Mouse a Cookie mentality, and he loses me a lot when he says to Beverly that the federation is killing her son. Tension rose with the bomb. KNEW you would LOVE Geordi getting his big moment. He didn’t even really raise his voice all that much whilst doing the damn thing. Adored your reaction to that. My own comment was, “Mr. La Forge, you are one very cool customer.” We shared a reaction when Picard sees Finn, has a “You motherfucker!” energy to him when running and cold cocking him right in the face, you screamed with joy, I yelled, “You see what happens, Finn!? You SEE what happens, Finn!? Do you SEE what happens, Finn, when you TAKE!? BEVERLY!? ON JEAN-LUC’S!? WATCH!? THIS IS WHAT HAPPENS, FINN, THIS IS WHAT HAPPENS!!!” Lord, the romance of it all sets fire to the soul and makes the blood sing. Patrick was beyond fantastic in that part. Whilst not good that they are both hostages, LOVE Picard and Beverly having their scenes. Adore your reactions to when they praise Wesley. Beverly says he has good role models. He has good parents, I say. We both live for the charged argument that matches Indy and Marion levels. Fantastic how Gates delivers on the scene where Beverly vents toward Finn, especially her line of being afraid of what he could do with real power. Leading to the bit with the sketchbook. No question, that part’s creepy. Love Worf getting the good moments of though getting hurt, he’s back on his feet, and with Riker leading the charge. I also loved Marina getting good Deanna moments, first, when she expresses concern for Geordi, second, when Finn delivered the message, how she holds her ground without showing fear. Oh, you and I, Jess, both had the same response when Beverly said she had to say something to Picard, and they get interrupted. We both had that, “No! Wait! What were you going to say!? Beverly!!” Great last scene for Finn where he tries to kill Picard, and Beverly half silently saying, “Don’t try it!” and he doesn’t listen, leading to Alexana shooting him. Picard and Beverly don’t kill him. But they don’t have to save him either. Love Alexana’s lines about knowing that it’s an imperfect solution, and how she exhibits further cynicism about the boy. Then Jonathan sells Riker’s hope that since the boy chose not to kill, perhaps that could just be the beginning of the cycle ending, and how Alexana has a good silent moment of hope that that could be true. Such a sweet reunion between mother and son, and how we all echo Picard with the “when you’re ready” line. So, like you said, this may be one upon reflection that you don’t like as much as you thought. Or perhaps it is one you like better than you thought upon reflection. Either way, it is one I quite liked, and I so loved your reaction this week, Jess, thank you so much.

Thomas Corp
>>155513722

I seem to be against the popular opinion as this is one that I really liked. Though yeah, if this was season one, we would have the scene of Dimitri being most aggrieved over getting the call that is not sociable and/or friendly in nature. Never mind the fact that if it wasn’t a friendly call, he probably wouldn’t even get it. I do get the complaints that the creative staff has, namely how they have the rather simplistic narrative without saying anything really profound. Good thing of the Alex Garland message by the way. Say this was a two-parter, and they never really dive into the politics or the social commentary, I’d be more agreeable to the complaints. As it is, I am sympathetic to them whilst noting that it is your standard network drama length episode, time is limited, and there’s the Siskel and Ebert mantra of setting aside what we don’t get, what we do get is good, and I love the character focus. Which is probably a big reason why I am forgiving toward it as I am as Beverly gets some real good focus here. I am most sympathetic to Snodgrass as I heard she said she was wanting the stronger Revolutionary War analogies with Picard as Cornwallis, and that would have made for an amazing story and episode. Instead, we get the allegories to the Troubles, and I don’t blame her for not liking that. The 2024 thing, to be fair, that’s a constant thing of just having a hard time comprehending how fast time goes by. It is one of those amusing things in retrospect, where you basically say, “Well, what can you do?” Having the hypothetical Irish unification in the 2100’s would have been better, especially as now that we are in the closing weeks of 2024. Still not as awkward as Back to the Future Part II where the newspaper has the thing about Washington preparing for Queen Diana’s visit. Again, an episode where I get how it’s not a particularly beloved episode, yet I quite liked it.

Ryan
>>155521047

It's quite fitting that this comes a day after the release of the middle section of Cobra Kai Season 6, where someone explicitly spells out a big part of the show's major theme, "This is going to continue forever unless someone is willing to say they were wrong." For what started out feeling uncomfortably like an edgelord "the movie's hero was the real bully" thing, it's quite admirable how the show reached that point early on and has stuck to it all these years. I'm also reminded a lot of a great line from The Orville, which quite a few bits of Trek over the years could stand to hear, "I respect your struggle. I really do. But don't disguise tactical opportunism as pious morality, because that's where you lose me."

Ryan
>>155513722

And of course, the franchise has had to deal for decades now with the whole "eugenics wars in the 1990s" thing. There's a novel which makes a truly heroic effort to portray how it could have happened without most of the world knowing about it, and Strange New Worlds finally just devoted an episode to saying that period has been subjected to so many time travel shenanigans that there's no use applying logical sense to it.

Thomas Corp
>>155513722

Reminds me, there was the line in the new Ghostbusters movie, “It was the eighties. Nobody was too worried about the future.”

Geordie Joe

"The Irish unification of 2024" That one line caused this episode to be banned from airing in the UK and Ireland during the 90s and when the ban was eventually lifted, some broadcasters like Sky edited the line out of the episode entirely. I also wish we got to see more of Alexana Devos, the Rutian police director. I agree she was a far more interesting character than Finn and I would've liked to have seen more of her story. I think this story would have benefited hugely from being a two-parter. They could have explored the political side of the story in more depth than what we got here, and we would've got more scenes with Alexana Devos. Geordi saving the ship from being destroyed despite only having about 3 minutes of screentime in the entire episode is impressive. Previous episode "Mr Worf, you are personally responsible for the captain's safety." Picard then proceeds to get abducted from the bridge of the Enterprise by terrorists in the very next episode. Worf just can't catch a break on this show. 😅 If you pause the episode just after Picard lands his punch on the bridge, you can see Patrick Stewart's stunt double taking the bump to the floor.